Interview with Tony Nyiam on 1990 Orkar Coup

April 22 2009 marks the 19th anniversary of the bloody and violent coup against the regime of General Ibrahim Babangida. On April 22, 1990, radical junior officers attempted a coup which nearly toppled Babangida’s regime. The coup failed after the dissidents excised five northern states from the Nigerian federation.  One of the few surviving ringleaders of the coup was Lt-Col Anthony Nyiam. This interview with Nyiam gets his perspective on the coup, nearly 20 years on….

From: http://allafrica.com/stories/200904210200.html

Lt-Col Anthony Nyiam

Nigeria: April 22 Coup Was Pro-Democratic Action – Nyiam

21 April 2009

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On April 22, 1990, a group of young army officers carried out what turned out to be an abortive coup. Many of these officers and other ranks including the man that broadcasted the ostracising of five core Hausa-Fulani states from Nigeria have been executed after being court-marshaled. There were some survivals including the coup leader, Col. Tony Nyiam, formerly of the Nigerian Army Engineers Corps, who escaped prosecution in the wake of the putsch’s futility.

In this interview with Assistant Politics Editor, MAXWELL ODITTA, Nyiam discusses the objectives of the coup, describing it as a pro-democratic action. He is full of praise for some dramatis personae of the coup including Emperor Dakolo, Gideon Orkar and Salibe Mukoro. He also bares his mind on his long ideological mind-meeting with Great Ogboru and late Ken Saro-Wiwa. The colonel also reveals the roles of Margaret Thatcher, Odumegwu Ojukwu and late Moshood Abiola, in the aftermath of the coup.

Excerpts:

You are reputed as the leader of the April 22, 1990 coup probably by virtue of your rank at the time vis-a-vis the other officers. It is 19 years since the coup. Many of those that took part in it have since been executed. What informed your participation in it and how did you manage to escape prosecution eventually?

First of all, I thank you for coming at this time and to have an interview which may be the anniversary of what happened on 22 April, 1990. I wasn’t the leader. I was like you said by implication the most senior officer amongst the officers. Two months to the action, a group of young, patriotic officers who were troubled by the drift in which the country was going into, a drift in which we would have ended up having the military in power forever, and also young men who were worried about the plight of the people from the Niger Delta where the oil was from.

These young boys were brilliant officers who were incidentally very close to the then military leader. They came and approached me, and the moment I got indication of what they were doing, as a military man, the tradition was for me to either report them or join them. I thought these young men were too honourable to be reported. In fact, their yearnings and their prayers was what I shared.

Unfortunately, they were full of overzealousness with lack of proper planning. I mean the young officers and not the likes of Major Gideon Orkar. So, I took the risk and joined them, instead of reporting them. That’s how I got myself into what I call a pro-democratic action. I use the word deliberately because without that action, we won’t have had democracy that we are now enjoying.

Are you now saying in essence that you did not participate in the operations of the abortive coup?

No. You asked me the question how I joined, but in the actual execution of the pro-democracy action, I participated. I did not participate in the coup.

How did you manage your way out of these shores?

I think like I have said it repeatedly, it wasn’t my doing. It was God’s doing.

What was life like in exile?

It was seemingly, that is apparently, difficult. But in reality, exile was good and thanks to God, because it gave me a chance to begin a new way of looking at life, education, to the extent that the opportunity allowed me to begin to understand myself and understand my relationship with the other man, my neighbour, and my relationship with the creator of me and my neighbour. I think it was the best. I think it was the best period in my life. And to that extent, I think it was an opportunity which I had to grasp.

You came back in the year 2000. What was your return like? How were you received, and what situation did you meet on ground?

It was an interesting event. I thank people like Anthony Enahoro, who was a mentor, Prof. Wole Soyinka and Harry Akande. In fact, Akande was the one who provided all of us with the means to come back with Enahoro and of course, our big brother, Gen. Alani Akinrinade.

We came back and the return was great, in that the late Beko Ransome-Kuti, who was a hero, a man we worked with, when we were in exile, when we were fighting, when the military was arresting many people and detaining them, Beko was always getting information to us, to the public, so that we can inform the international community as to the plight of many politicians today who were detained. Beko worked so hard. This by the way is why I have so much respect for Kayode Fayemi.

Fayemi was a young doctorate from the Kings College, whose house was the operations rooms for informing the world and mobilising the world against the military dictatorial rule in Nigeria. Fayemi and his wife sacrificed everything, every money they had to build and to link, and exploiting their contacts created a platform for we Nigerians in exile to be able to be heard. And this is why, like I will say later, Fayemi deserves to be paid back. Fayemi is like Obama, a community organiser. More so, even his wife. His wife has one of the biggest poverty alleviation civil society groups in the world. Empowering women allover, she is known all over Africa. So is Fayemi too.

Fayemi has been in the area of capacity building to improve governance in Africa. All this the young man started when he was fighting against the military. He fought for democracy. By the way, people don’t know, he was the mastermind of Radio Kudirat.

You participated so much in pro-democracy activities in Europe. How did you join this activism? Because the incidence of annulment of June 12, 1993 presidential election took place at least three years after you left the country. So, how did you link up with the agitators?

First of all, people did not realise that Abiola had always been a democrat at heart and a patriot. He was as patriotic as he was philanthropic. During our action, when all other newspapers would not give us a chance to be heard. It was the National Concord’s Chief MKO Abiola who compelled his son, one of the Abiolas, saying are you not a journalist? If you are a journalist, you give people a freehand. Give every side a chance to be heard. And he compelled him, even when his son was afraid of what would happen. Abiola even as close as he was to Babangida, he impressed on his son to give a chance for us to be heard.

Before then, we had known MKO. Myself and Ken Saro-Wiwa had always told leaders of the South West that our problem was a national question problem. They did not believe it. I remember many times with Alao Aka-Bashorun, the former NBA President, they always thought it was an issue of national question. They always thought it was the issue of leadership. We said no, it was the issue of national question. It was an issue of restoring federalism, which General Yakubu Gowon as a way of fighting the war, ensured a temporary suspension of federalism to restore unity government to execute the civil war. But later, some people with vested interest saw it as continuing in actuality governance of unitary government and openly claimed that we are having federalism. Giving that lie that we have federalism when we have not, was what we told the South West leaders then was the problem. They did not believe it until the whole thing showed up with the annulment of June 12.

So, when MKO came over, after he escaped over to the U.K, when he was to be killed, we met, and he recruited me to start working for him. We started working. It was even then he recommended the great people we should watch and very reliable hands that we need for the struggle. Long before then, he told me so much about Asiwaju Bola Tinubu, that he was a young man full of ideas, a real democrat, a real organiser and a real leader to watch and that he will want us to meet to work. So, MKO introduced Asiwaju Bola Tinubu. Before MKO even escaped, it was Soyinka who had told me too about this young man, Tinubu. That’s how we started. At the same time, I met Fayemi when I was being interviewed by the BBC World Service. He also was doing a programme. That’s how we met and then that’s how we started.

In other words, we have foreseen what’s going to happen, like the June 12. We had foreseen it and we have started working, myself, Great Ogboru and Ken Saro-Wiwa, long before June 12. It was later people now realised that it was an issue of national question and that’s that.

When you were in exile, was there any physical effort by the then Federal Military Government to hunt you?

Oh, yes. The British government gave me good protection and in fact I must say the then Prime Minister, Margaret Thatcher, had to warn Babangida that in no attempt must he try to do anything like they did to Umaru Dikko against me. And so, for the first one year or so, I enjoyed complete British secret services protection.

How did it feel when you were told that the young officers who took part in the abortive coup, those who were arrested in action have actually been executed?

It’s always sad to have any loss. It was very sad. But the thing about the team is that they were courageous young men. They died following the footsteps of the apostles. They died courageously. And I give credit to Dakolo and all the rest. They were great guys. They were true soldiers. They were true military officers. All I can say is that God used these chaps and used us to try and arrest a situation where we would have had life presidency of military descendants.

Are you still in touch with Major Mukoro?

Prof. Salibe Mukoro. We are still in touch.

He is now a Professor?

He is a Professor of Criminology of a university in the U.S.

So, he is not based in the country?

Oh, he’s being in the U.S. He is a renowned criminologist in the U.S.

The coup plotters at their trial in 1990: L to R - Capt Harley Empere, Major Gideon Orkar, Capt Perebo Dakolo, Lt Cyril Ozoalor, Lt Nicholas Odeh

What’s your recollection of Major Gideon Orkar?

Oh, thanks for that good question. Major Gideon Orkar ever remains a hero. He is my hero and he remains a hero to many people. He was a young man who was concerned about restoring dignity to every Nigerian in general and to the military in particular. With what we all stood, if what we went for went well, Nigeria would have been as democratic as Ghana is. And that is why we think that with the way Ghana has a free and fair election, it will be a big mistake if President Yar’Adua allows those charlatans to mislead go for anything short of free and fair elections in Ekiti.

What’s your relationship with former President Ibrahim Babangida on one hand, Chief Great Ogboru on the other?

Chief Great Ogboru remains, to me, a great man, a patriot and a man who loves the human beings. And on those bases, we ever remain life friends and he is a great friend. Babangida is a person I admire for his generosity. And also, I admire him for the gifts God gave him. He is a brilliant man who was a workaholic endowed with a very active mind. But unfortunately, he was a man who did not realise the potential for collective good.

You said Babangida is a workaholic and all that. At least today, do you relate with him? Is there any melting point between you and him?

No, we do not relate. We were not really one to one. But I am always appreciative when he is working, when he is trying to work towards restoring his name and working towards correcting the ills he was misled to do against Nigerians.

At the launch of two books written by you somewhere in December 2002 at the MUSON Centre, Dim Odumegwu Ojukwu was the chairman of occasion. This is not somebody you are known to have associated with in any form. What informed his choice?

No, Dim Ojukwu, you must know, is a leader. When I mentioned Ken Saro Wiwa, Great Ogboru and I am thinking well ahead that the problem of Nigeria was problem of national question, Ojukwu had been one of our mentors. We knew Ojukwu long before and we had always met and he was one of our mentors. So, I hold him in high regard as a young officer to have spearheaded a meeting and the agenda and objective of that meeting, the Aburi Accord was the national question. In spite of what we say, until we addressed what was agreed in the Aburi Accord, we will be going round in circles.

Are you saying that Ojukwu was more or less a mentor to even Ken Saro-Wiwa?

It is unfortunate that Saro-Wiwa is not alive. He would have answered that question. But Ojukwu was a mentor to me as regards understanding the intricacy of Nigeria. Incidentally, I must say Ojukwu – you would not understand – educated me to know that even the Fulanis were not the problem. It is actually those who have criss-cross identity who claim to be Fulanis but at times do bad things in the name of Fulanis. Ojukwu understands all parts of Nigeria. Remember Ojukwu grew up in Lagos. His mother lived in the North, and here was a young man who speaks Yoruba very well.

So, he understood every part. He then educated me, because some of us after April 22 had some misconceptions. Ojukwu sat us down to correct all those misconceptions, whichever were that the problem in Nigeria was not that it was the problem of the Hausa-Fulani, but it was the problem of those who have hijacked Hausa-Fulani power, those Fulani banza. I used the word Fulani banza, those who pretend to be Fulani, they are the ones who are giving the Fulani the bad name. And Ojukwu is proved right. If you look at the lives of the true patriotic Fulanis, like Ahmadu Bello, like Yar’Adua, like Shehu Shagari, like Gen. Buhari and of course the present Sultan of Sokoto and his father, you could see that the trend in all these people is nobility, integrity.

But when you now have the other Fulanis, who are, you may say, pretentious Fulanis, they are the ones who are the problem. Another good Fulani and a man of integrity is the present Secretary to the Government, Yayale Ahmed. Ask anybody who goes to the Babangida Polo Club in Abuja. He is the true gentleman. This is what Fulanis are. But those who came to project themselves to be Fulanis, who some of us thought were Fulanis and who as well gave Fulanis bad names were what Ojukwu as part of mentoring corrected.

So, Ojukwu, people do not know, is really at heart a man who loved all Nigerians. The same regards he has for the true Yorubas, he has for the Hausa-Fulani. Where some of us were wrong, Ojukwu corrected us. He also taught us about the issue of true federalism saying that until we restore true federalism to the country, we will go no where.

You were in exile when you heard about the judicial murder of Saro-Wiwa. How did the news come to you?

It was a shock, because Saro-Wiwa was a man full of energy. He was a man who wanted to liberate people like me coming from a minority. And he was far ahead in the liberation movement and he was internationally linked to minorities all over the world, who were oppressed.

In fact, people don’t know that the works of people like Ken Saro-Wiwa led to what happened in Eastern Moore, because he was friendly with those people. He educated them. And also, in Eritrea, Saro-Wiwa also improved their capacity to fight for their freedom. He was well known. That’s why he was well liked. But I must also say that myself and Great warned Ken Saro-Wiwa. Initially he believed too much in his friend and we warned him to be careful.

So, we were shocked when we thought more than what we expected that his friend can go to the extent of killing him.

By his friend, you mean late Sani Abacha?

Indeed.

How do you view Abacha as a general and as a military Head of State?

General Abacha, I know, was a real soldier. Amongst the people who paraded themselves as generals before my time, there were people I have always respected. Of course, Gen. T.Y Danjuma, Gen. Muhammadu Buhari, Col Benjamin Adekunle, and amongst the young toughs who were active in the counter-coup against Kaduna Nzeogwu’s coup, Gen Murtala Muhammed. But of the young ones, the only man who was a man of courage among them was Gen Sani Abacha. That was why in anything they did, if he wasn’t there, the rest didn’t have enough confidence. Most of the rest drew their courage from Abacha.

You also must realise that we from the South-South, we give credit to Abacha, in that he was the one who re-established the need for respect for the zones. Remember he as well brought in the whole idea of respect for the six zones. To that extent, Abacha gave us something.

You’ve spoken so much about Fayemi. Ekiti poll is at the door. If he wins, he becomes the governor of Ekiti State. Anything else otherwise would make his effort futile. And you said that he should be rewarded for his pro-democracy activities of the past. What are your expectations of Ekiti governorship bye-election?

First of all, I am not asking that one should just reward Kayode for his past. Kayode is an asset. He is a young man who is an organiser, who can build community. In many respect, in Ekiti, he is like Obama. He will turn Ekiti round. What I know of the young man and from his connection with India and everywhere else. I think Kayode would turn Ekiti valleys – you know Ekiti is a beautiful place full of valleys – into the silicon valley of Nigeria. Ekiti will become like that the Bangalore of Nigeria. Kayode has that potential to turn Ekiti around.

And not only that, he has the connection internationally to pull in those who will help to do that. Also, if you look at Kayode’s friends like Prof. Gbadegesin, like Soyinka who is one of his mentors, like Tinubu who is his political mentor. You would see that he would be another Fashola pillar. In other words, I foresee an extension of the urban regeneration and the empowering of people that is happening in Lagos, in Ekiti. So, it will be really great for Ekiti not to miss the boat.

Of course, Olusegun Mimiko is another great future that has come up in our polity. Mimiko and Adam Oshiomhole of Edo, I think Kayode will be adding to these fresh hands coming into our politics.

Let’s look at the Niger Delta, the youth restiveness and the crisis in that part of the country is still very much at the highest ebb. What do you think should be the solution to the problems of the Niger Delta?

Like I have said in many fora, Yar’Adua’s new overture of honesty is the beginning of the solution. All that needs to be put in place is a proper truth and reconciliation, as was the case in the conflict between the Irish and the British Army. So, we need an independent umpire who will come and dwell and be the real reconciliation office. I would have thought that the likes of Kofi Annan would be a good candidate. If not the likes of Ambassador Olusola in Nigeria here, people like that could be invited. These are peacemakers and men with track records. We need a neutral umpire to come in and to reconcile, so as to bring in trust that is necessary for true amnesty. That should be followed by a proper arms decommissioning exercise, which again like the examples in the U.K should be chaired by a neutral general.

With this process in place, it should be followed by government not playing lips service to empowering the people of Niger Delta. The short example of the governor of Delta, Emmanuel Uduaghan – the youth empowerment scheme he started is an example and that has helped to reduce crisis in Delta State. I think if it does mean well, the government can do the same in the Niger Delta. The government is fortunate to have a Secretary to Government, Alhaji Yayale Ahmed who had an initiative of an approach which was less military approach of empowering the youths and getting them away from committing crimes in the Niger Delta. So, I think these are my suggestions that the government should be sincere and reach out on the basis of the ills that the people of the Niger Delta have suffered. They must do that.

One symbol that they must show in the light of this amnesty is that the likes of Henry Okah, who is highly respected by the youths of the Niger Delta even more than politicians from that region, should be released. He, Asari Dokubo and Ateke Tom and the other patriots can be used as a way of restoring peace and tranquility in the region.

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Igbo Soldiers Plotted Coup from Independence Day – David Ejoor

Lt-Colonel David Ejoor

Igbo soldiers plotted coup from independence day – Ejoor

From the Nigerian Compass
In a three-part thriller that is sure to send historians about the Nigerian Civil War back to library shelves, the Military Governor of the… defunct Midwest Region, Major General David Akpode Ejoor, says military coups in Nigeria began right from independence in 1960.

In this interview with BIMBO OGUNNAIKE and AZEEZ FOLURUNSHO, he shredded several claims and set-positions about the country’s past and future. Firing from the hips, like a war veteran that he is, and in a no-holds-barred interview, [b]Ejoor maintains that the political and military leaders of Igbo extraction had nursed the ambition of upturning the Nigerian political space because their leading light, Dr. Nnamdi Azikiwe, emerged only as a nominal Governor-General while power resided in another geo-political zone. [/b]The concluding parts of the rare interview will be served you, dear readers, next Saturday and the week after. Excerpts:

You appear to be more of an enigma to Nigerians, most of whom know very little about you despite being an open-book; one about whom so much has been said and written. Who, really, are you, sir?

A woman called Uvwerhero gave birth to me. I was born in 1932. She put me in school and when I finished my school, she sent me to the Government College , Ugheli. When I finished college, I didn´t have money to continue to do the HSC or to enter the university. My school principal gave me a letter to the Comptroller of Customs in Warri. I didn´t know what was in the letter and so when the Comptroller read it, he said your principal said I should give you a job. He asked me: “When are you starting?” I said now. He said: “All right, come tomorrow”. That was how I started work in the Customs.

What year was that?

In 1953. After the first six months, one of my colleagues came from the college to say that they were looking for the people to join the army. I told him that I was already working but he gave me the form. Out of interest, I filled the form and by September 1953, they replied me and said that I should come to Enugu for examination to join the army. I didn´t know that day, I didn´t know Enugu . To tell the Comptroller of Customs that he should excuse me to go to Enugu for exam, I couldn´t do it. I had to resign and go to look for money because at that time any money they gave to me at the end of the month, I gave it to my elder brother to keep for me. I did not keep the money. When I wanted to resign, I didn´t have any money. so, I had to rush to him in school and told him that he should give me money; that I wanted to resign. He said. `you are playing with your certificate.´ He gave me money and I went to the treasury, paid and dropped my letter to the Comptroller of Customs and I didn´t allow him to read it before I left. I just ran away from him because I knew he would not let me go. The following day, I asked my mother to get me some money and three days after, I found my way to Enugu to do the exam there.

How many of you sat for the examination that day?

We were six, but at the end of the day, we were asked to come for an interview in Lagos . I was the only one who passed from Enugu . We did the interview in Lagos and only four of us passed. The four of us were then sent to Ghana to do our initial training at the Regular Officers Training School . After six months, those of us who passed, about four, were selected to go to England to do the Officers Cadet Training. When we got to England , we went to another selection board and it happened that two of us passed — that is I and Victor Banjo, who worked with Ojukwu. So, Banjo and I went to England to do first, the Short Service Commission Course which lasted for six months. At the end of the six months, we were asked to go to Sandhurst for interview. At Sandhurst , we did almost three years course. We were commissioned in 1956 by the Queen, the present Queen, and then we came back to Nigeria . Some of us later went back to England for other military
trainings.

When you were about joining the army, what was your parents´ attitude?

The immediate brother by my mother was killed by some people in 1951. So, as far as Army was concerned at that time, people would say when you join the Army, you were going to die. So, I couldn´t tell my mother that I wanted to join the army because she would never agree. I did all these, went to Accra for the training and after the training I now told her that I was going to England but it would be training in the army and she couldn´t say no then because I was the only boy left and the other two sisters were the only three left out of seven children which she had before.

Do you share the view that Biafra was a tragic mistake in Nigeria ´s history?

First of all, let me tell you this, when the British were here, we were the last Nigerian officers to be commanded by the British soldiers. (He called for a picture hung on the wall of his sitting room to be brought down to show the first set of Nigerian military officers at that period).The senior person to me in Nigeria was Bassey, the second was Aguiyi Ironsi.  The Igbos wanted to rule. Why they wanted to rule was that (Nnamdi) Azikiwe was the then Governor-General and more or less Head of State. The constitution did not give any power to Azikiwe. So, this annoyed the Igbo people and they used to say: “How can we run a constitution in which the Head of State cannot advise the government, the government cannot contact the Head of State for any advice?” So, the answer was well to take over since they were already leading and yet they had no control over the government. That was why the Igbo soldiers decided to organise a coup. But at that time, there were four major leading officers which included me, Yakubu Gowon, Bassey and Ojukwu. Igbo people relied on Ojukwu for the coup and they were able to convince the Yoruba. Ojukwu and Banjo now contacted me and Gowon for a coup. But we refused.

How many of you refused to participate in the planned coup then?

Gowon and I refused and they went on their own. But we then reported to that European officer, General Foster. I and Gowon reported to him that some people were trying to plan a coup. He called all of us — the Nigerian Army officers — and advised us not to organise any military coup. When Ojukwu´s father heard about this, he put a memo into House of Assembly that all Europeans should leave the army. It was that year that all the Europeans in the army were sent back to their country. Then, Ironsi, who was Number Two, took over the command of the army. While he was there, Ojukwu still had the coup plot in his mind. He told Ironsi that he should not allow Ejoor and Gowon to be in Army Headquarters, saying as long they remained in Army headquarters, they would not be able to execute the coup. So, Ironsi sent Gowon on a course in the United Kingdom but he left me alone.[/b] When Igbos were worrying him that Ejoor was still there, he told them that: “This man from that small state, minority state? You can handle him, he cannot do anything. Go away, and leave me.” So, he left me. By December when Gowon came back, it was like a small war in Ironsi´s office. Some army officers told Ironsi that: “We told you to send these two people away, now Gowon has come back. What can we do now? Ironsi was embarrassed and after Gowon came back on the 20th and on the 23rd of that month, Ironsi now sent me away from Army headquarters to Enugu, saying: “He should be hidden there.” I went there and then they tried again but the one they tried was in January 1966 after I had left the Army headquarters. But at that time, they said whatever happened, Ejoor and Gowon must die. They threatened the person who was to organise a coup on behalf of the Igbos in Lagos side.

Who was that person?

Emmanuel Ifeajuna. The one in Kaduna , Nzeogwu. I think you know that one. Ifeajuna was holding a very big post in the Brigade then. He was a Chief of Staff to Maimalari. He sent a message that we had this meeting which would last a week; that I should come to Lagos . He was the one who booked me into Ikoyi Hotel in Room 17 and my number in the army was 17.. It was a lucky number for me. I got to Lagos for the meeting and then the meeting started on Monday. Then on Thursday, I can’t recall what happened in my hotel room. I just complained that I didn’t like the room. They couldn´t change it on Thursday. It was on Friday, the last day of the meeting that I came back to the hotel by 4.30 pm. When I got to the hotel, they had changed my room because they knew that the following day, I would leave. I said all right. Because of the cocktail party which Maimalari organised for us, we could not come back on time. I left the cocktail party at about 11 p.m when
we should have left at 8.00 pm.There was no need for us to come on time. Although he called it a cocktail party, it was like a buffet dinner. So, I ate to my satisfaction and when I got to the hotel, I didn´t go to the dining room to eat again; I just went straight to my bed and slept off. It was at three o’clock that night that the coup plotters came. [b]They killed my colleague, the one commanding the Western Region, and after putting his body in the booth of the car, they rushed to my room, to Room 17, to kill me thinking that I was there. According to their story, they didn´t want me to see them. So, when they kicked the door open, they just sprayed the bed with bullets and then round before they switched on the light. When they switched on the light, nobody was there and they started saying to themselves, “he is gone, he is gone” and I was snoring downstairs. That was how, at least, I can tell that God saved me from the coup.[/b] Now, for Gowon.

Gowon had just come back on the 20th of December and he was posted to take over a battalion in Ikeja. He had not moved to his official house.. He was staying in one of the Officers Mess accommodation. On that night, he did not come back to where he was staying because he went to see his prospective in-law. He did not come back in time, so when the coup plotters went there, they did not see him. They were now saying it is me and Gowon that would counter their coup and on the following day the news was that there was a coup. The following day, I was told that my colleague was killed and I went to his room and all what I saw was just blood. His body was not in the room and so I went to the person who was in charge, Brigadier Pam to come and take the blood sample and check. But when I got to that place, his wife told me that his husband was taken away in the middle of the night around 3.00 a.m. to a rendezvous where he was killed. Then, I rushed to Maimalari’s house who was then our commander where we had the cocktail party. When we got there, his soldiers just told me that Maimalari was killed in Ikoyi, Awolowo Road by the petrol station that night. I now told myself, ‘how can I just rush to Enugu when I have heard this bad news.’ So, I went to Ironsi´s house whether he could tell me anything before I went to Enugu . But when I got there, his soldiers said he left his house at 4..00 o’clock in the morning. What do I do? The head of the army, we could not find him. So, I said to myself, let me go to the Army unit, maybe I would get more information from them. I rushed to Ikeja Battalion and it was there, luckily, I saw his car in a car park. I sent my guard to check his office if there was anybody, and to ask if I should come in. And then I heard them all shouting: “Tell him to come. Tell him to come.”  So, I went in. He opened the door for me and when I got in, I saw Ironsi sitting opposite the door pointing a gun at me, saying: ” David, are you with me or against me?” It was a surprise to him because he thought I was dead. So, I shouted back at him that “you are our father. Whatever it is, I am with you. What is it, anyway?” He said: “All right, sit down.” So, I sat down and he told me how the Prime Minister contacted him to say that he was being attacked with Okotie- Eboh and all that. He promised me he was going to get some help, but he couldn´t raise any help and that was why I had to go to the battalion itself, to get some soldiers under his command. He told me that he had to send Gowon out with soldiers to trace the coup plotters. I couldn´t see Gowon at that time. After I had told him the story, then he said he was going to the Police headquarters for a meeting where he was appointed Head of State. I told him I was going to Enugu to join my troops and also to join my wife and children. He just turned round to me and said, “David, I cannot order you to Enugu now.” He did not want me to go to Enugu.
Why did he not want you to go to Enugu ?

Probably, in their plan, I was to have been killed. I was not in their team. He said I should not go to Enugu and he left. I now concluded that Ironsi was part of the coup and that I could no longer rely on him because he was part of the coup plotters. I said to myself that my loyalty is to my country and I would not take any instruction from any officer anymore. I said if I went to Enugu by road, I would not arrive there. So, I went to the airport for an aircraft to take to Enugu . When I got to Enugu , everybody was shaking. The officer, my Second in Command, Major Gabriel Okonweze, told me that he was not expecting me. I asked him why he was not expecting me. He said he was given instruction to take over the command of the battalion, that I was not coming back. I said how did you get this information? Is it by radio, telephone or what? He said no and put his hand in his pocket and brought out a letter saying he should take over the command of the battalion. When I put the letter inside my pocket, he said no, that it was his letter and I said, “but I am still the commander.”

I left the battalion and went to see Dr. Opara, the governor of Eastern Region, came back to the battalion and ordered that all soldiers that were deployed outside the battalion should be brought back to the barrack. I assembled them by 4.00 o’clock and addressed them. My second-in-command was telling me, “don´t tell them that anybody is dead. Don´t tell them anything?” I said I would tell them; these people were taken to unknown destinations, I will not say I saw any dead body, I saw blood. Yes, I cannot say so but if I do not mention it that way, when they get to know, you and I would be the first victim of Hausa soldiers. I told them what I knew and then we ran the battalion with peace. Then on the third day when Ironsi was made the Head of State, he withdrew me from Enugu and called me back to Lagos .

Why do you think he removed you from Enugu ?

He removed me from Enugu because since I was still not dead, he could not trust me in Enugu . When I got to Lagos , he now said that I should be the Governor of the Mid- West.

Did he do that to compensate you?

More or less. But, you know that he had to behave in a way to show that he still liked me. Having removed me from Enugu , he brought me to Benin and that time, most of the officers in the Mid-West were from Anioma area, predominantly Igbo, because as it was, we were nine Lieutenant-Colonels in the Mid-West. I was the only Urhobo and the remaining eight were Anioma. Now that the person they wanted to kill was the governor, how was I to rule that place with satisfaction? I worked with them. I did not know that they were against me. I worked with them in the day time, but in the night, they worked against me. It wasn´t easy. God just preserved me because they did all sorts of things to see whether I could die.
When General Ironsi came on a visit to your region, 24 hours after he left your zone, he was kidnapped by some sections of the army along with the Governor of the Western Region where they were killed.

What was in your mind when you heard the news?

The fact was this. He visited Western Region after leaving my place. The idea was that he did not want my killing to take place while he was there

Your own killing?

Yes. When he got to Ibadan , the counter-coup people, Brigadier Danjuma, waylaid him. It was there they waylaid him and killed him in Ibadan . When he was with Fajuyi, Fajuyi did not want them to take Ironsi away just like that. That was why they killed Fajuyi with Ironsi, not that they had anything against Fajuyi at that time. That was how I escaped death for the second time. As I am talking to you, I have looked at death, where there was nothing I could do, I was just waiting for death to come, for seven times. How many people have gone through that? Looking at death, not that I was told. The other ones that happened when I did not know is different, but the ones I saw, I know.

Are you saying the lack of trust and the in-fighting among the top generals at that time led to Nigeria ´s civil war?

The civil war was straightforward. the Igbo wanted to take over the ruling of Nigeria . When all these cunny-cunny actions that people who were preventing them from organising a coup had not been killed, that is Gowon and I, the only thing left was to have a civil war. That was why there was a civil war and in the civil war, the first place Ojukwu attacked was the Mid-West. Now, I do not know that he was already in league with all the officers from Anioma area. When the Federal Government was suspecting them, most of them ran away to the East and joined Ojukwu in the Biafran army. At that time, Banjo himself, being a friend to Ojukwu because they joined the army the same day and commissioned, was suspected to be organising a coup. Ironsi had sent him, well not to prison but more or less arrested but sent to the East where he was detained in one of the prisons there. But being a friend to Ojukwu, Ojukwu released him and made him the Commander of the Biafran troops. And he was the one who commanded the Biafran soldiers to come and attack Mid- West before moving to Lagos . The Igbo tried to rule Nigeria by force, what they cannot do through the ballot box; they tried it through coup. They tried the coup, it failed and now decided to do a civil war. It was a contract. That is the basic thing.

During this war, you said Ojukwu was coming from the East through your zone to Lagos . What were the things you put in place to checkmate him at that time?

As I told you, I did not know. It was just that morning that I heard firing in the State House where I was told that the Biafran Army was in the Mid- West. I could not believe that Banjo would be the person to kill me because he was the nearest person to me in the army. What happened was that when they got to Ikpoba Hills in Benin , the person that was sent by Ojukwu to kill me was ordered to take me dead or alive to Enugu was different because Banjo did not know about this. When they got to Ikpoba Hill, this officer from the Mid West, from Anioma, told Banjo he should give him time; let him go and find out where I was in Benin and take me to Enugu , dead or alive. The firing started at about 7.00 o’clock. I just managed to get the radio to tell Gowon that I was being attacked by the Biafran army. I took the weapon of the operator and ran down to the gate to join the soldiers who were firing and we started firing together. But after sometime, we ran out of ammunition.

What do we do? I knew that if they came in, they were coming for me to kill me. These soldiers who were defending me, why should I allow them to die? And then if I leave this place they would be killed, including my wife and children. Why should I allow any of these people to be killed? I said they had to kill me first so that other people would survive. I jumped down from where I was and walked towards where they were firing. I thought that that was the end. I didn´t know what was happening and then I found myself in a veranda in one of the houses not far from the State House. I decided to move my leg but I couldn´t move any part of my body. I looked up and I saw somebody holding my leg and my hand. He was kneeling down when I was thinking about other things. I did not know that somebody was holding me. I now asked him who are you? He said he was Chief Asemota. I thanked him and said I had to go now. He sad “no, you can´t go, they are everywhere.” When he got up and started dragging me in, I asked him have you not seen any of the Biafran soldiers here? He answered that they were two in this veranda. It wasn´t long when they left that you came.These are the ones that would have killed you. I said: “My time has come; those who sent me here want me dead. My time has come. Let me go so that you or any of your family members will not die.” He said no. I argued and argued but he did not agree. So, I got up annoyed, to walk out. But before I could get to the door, he ran past me, he locked the door and threw the key out through the window. So, what do I do now? I could not break the door like that. Then I persuaded him that he should go and look for an Urhobo person around the area who could take me away from Benin . I waited for him and he found somebody from Urhobo who said he was coming. In the afternoon, in the night, we did not see him.

So, I said he was not interested. The following morning, around 7.00 o’clock, I heard a woman shouting: “There is war; you are going there if they kill you now, who will bury me?” That was what he was saying in Urhobo. I peeped through the window and I saw the woman running after the son, and returning into the compound I recognized him as one of the people with whom we grew up together.

What is the name of that person, sir?

John Ebuche. So, I opened the door and told him, “look, take your mother home,” and turned. He took his mother home.

A Generals´General

That Major General David Akpode Ejoor (rtd) parades an intimidating profile is an understatement. Commissioned in 1953 in the United Kingdom , he is a Grand Commander of the Order of the Niger (GCON) and an Officer of the Federal Republic (OFR). Ejoor also holds the prestigious Royal College of Defence Studies (RCDS), UK ; a Pass Staff College (PSC) and a honorary Doctor of Letters (LL. D), of the University of Benin (UNIBEN).
He was a member of the Supreme Military Council from 1966 to 1975, the first Military Governor of Mid-Western State between 1966 and 1967; Chief of Army Staff, from 1972 to 1975, when he retired.
His medals include the Congo , Independence , Republic, Defence Service, General Service and National Service. He is a Grand Commander of the Republic of Togo , and has received the Order of the two Niles-Ist Class Sudan , the Grand Officer O.N. Du Lion Senegal and Kt. Order of the Crown, Belgium . His chieftaincy titles include the Olorogun Oloho of Olomu, Okakuro-Egbe of Agbon, Okakuro of Ovu, Onotuku of Ebor and Orhuerakpo Ru Ughelli.

Interview with Nasir El-Rufai

Former FCT Minister, Nasir El-Rufai

This is an excellent interview with the controversial former Minister of the Federal Capital Territory, Nasir El-Rufai. He defends his stewardship, and decisions he took in government, and appraises the Yar’Adua government.

For those who do not have the patience to read the whole interview, the most telling statements he made were:

“I do not think President Yar’Adua is doing enough to even keep Nigeria at the level he found it. From what I read and hear, things are a bit worse than in May 2007. But you live in Nigeria, you reflect and get your readers to reflect as well, is your life better now than it was two years ago?”

“James Ibori had boasted that since he cannot go to London, he would ensure that my passport is seized when I come, and this was communicated to me.”

“if Ibori was actively prosecuted, then the new administration is serious about fighting corruption. I added that if Ribadu were promoted out of his EFCC job, it would be a clear sign that the intentions are suspect. This was in mid-2007. I rest my case.”

‘Yar’Adua Not Doing Enough To Even Keep Nigeria At The Level He Found It’

From: http://www.ngrguardiannews.com/policy_politics/article01//indexn3_html?pdate=040409&ptitle=%27Yar%27Adua%20Not%20Doing%20Enough%20To%20Even%20Keep%20Nigeria%20At%20The%20Level%20He%20Found%20It%27&cpdate=040409

Former Federal Capital Territory (FCT) minister, Mallam Nasir El-rufai in this online interview with GODWIN IJEDIOGOR speaks on his tenure, persecution, the Pentascope deal and President Umaru Musa Yar’Adua.

Some people say you are only suffering a bit of what some people suffered due to the demolition exercises under your tenure as Federal Capital Territory minister?

Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion, but I am not suffering. For two years I have pursued my life’s interests and I live in relative comfort. I have been contacted and complimented by many people, including some that lost property to the corrective actions we took in Abuja.

On Facebook, I have reached the limit of 5,000 friends, with over 1,200 standing by to be my friends. Some are critical, most of them compliment and commend the work I did, and that is the next generation.

The tragicomedy in Nigeria, whether it takes place in the Villa, the Senate or the FCT, does not bother me at all. I thought through all I did and as I said, we did what had to be done, which others are now copying.

To some Nigerians, your tenure is credited with restoring Abuja to viability as the federal capital. What could be responsible for your achievements in that regard?

I think my education and training as a chartered quantity surveyor, knowledge of Abuja and being in the Bureau for Public Enterprise (BPE) and therefore familiar with how the federal government functioned all helped a lot.

Secondly and by far the most important success factor was the political will of then President Olusegun Obasanjo to see that Abuja reverted to the vision he and Gen. Murtala Mohammed had in 1976.

Thirdly, unlike most ministers, I knew my portfolio was FCT at least a month in advance and began visioning, planning and prioritising with my aides while in BPE. So from day one, we knew where we wanted to go and it was not easy to lead us in another direction.

Finally, we gave our staff the freedom and wherewithal to do what was right, no matter whose ox was gored and they knew I would stand by them, take the heat and the responsibility for their actions.

But critics say some of these achievements came at huge social and personal costs to victims, who lost a lot?

All public policies have cost and benefits, winners and losers. What should guide public action is the overall collective good. Our actions in FCT hurt a few people, who by the way mostly broke the law. The benefits are an organised, orderly city, with high quality of social services.

The reality is that most state governors are now copying our courageous examples in Abuja, several years after we did what had to be done. Abuja is there for all to see.

There have been complaints that your administration acted illegally in demolitions and land allocations, including disobedience of court orders?

The claims are false, even the highly biased Senate Committee could not produce a single case in which I disobeyed any court order. All the people that came with allegations disappeared before I appeared before the Senate Committee.

Regarding demolitions and revocations, only a court can decide whether we acted illegally or not. The Senate Committee can make no such pronouncement and we have challenged every single one of their resolutions in the Federal High Court. All those that challenged our revocations in the courts have lost; the most recent one was Governor Peter Obi of Anambra State.

So the Senate is wrong and the courts will prove this in time.

You are alleged to own several properties, especially in Abuja, acquired during your tenure as minister, sometimes using cronies?

That is untrue. I have no property in Abuja, except the so-called Atiku Guest House, which I bought under the sale of government houses program. I had a terraced house in Stallion Estate, which I sold to facilitate my movement to the United States (US) for my degree program and fellowship at Harvard.

The Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC) made several allegations of houses that I won, these will be subject of future litigation in some jurisdictions, but they are all false. I have said this and I will say it again; if you find any property that belongs to me that is not in my asset declaration, seize it.

The weird belief that any property owned by any friend of mine, however close or remote, must be mine is not only unfair, unjust and unreasonable, but also quite dangerous. I am not a venal person and do not care for material accumulation.

I am also not a pretentious hypocrite, who will allocate land to his wife under another name. If I wanted to allocate land to myself, I will do it in my name. I am not the coward and hypocrite that some people are. The owners of the properties will meet them in domestic courts…and I will meet them somewhere, somehow, soon.

Some of your policies as FCT minister are either being reversed or reviewed?

No government can bind a future government, so they are free to reverse whatever they want to reverse. They will bear the consequences and history will judge us all. What we did led to results that even our enemies grudgingly admit. What our successors do is their business, not ours.

Do you think President Umaru Yar’Adua is doing enough to uplift Nigeria?

I do not think President Yar’Adua is doing enough to even keep Nigeria at the level he found it. From what I read and hear, things are a bit worse than in May 2007. But you live in Nigeria, you reflect and get your readers to reflect as well, is your life better now than it was two years ago?

So do you think he merits a second term?

That is up to Nigerians to decide, if their votes are allowed to matter. I will certainly not vote for him, but I am sure his family would not agree with my view.

What is your relationship with Obasanjo and former Vice President Atiku Abubakar now?

I am in contact with President Obasanjo. In fact, I spoke to him earlier in the week when he was on his way to South Africa, I think. My relationship with Obasanjo remains that of a caring father and a favoured son.

I have not spoken to Atiku Abubakar since we left office. I hear he is doing well and planning to run for President in 2011. I wish him luck.

What is your regret as FCT minister and given another opportunity to serve, what would you do differently?

I am writing my memoirs, where I will document my regrets and all the areas I think I screwed up. Since I need you to buy the book, I will not answer this question fully.

Human beings are not perfect, so we make mistakes. But I do not think about what I would do differently, as I have never repeated a class; I never do any job twice. Once is enough.

After school, what next for you?

A short vacation and then back home to Nigeria. If the government does not seize my passport, I will rest a bit, then go to China to start my Mandarin learning program. If they keep me within Nigeria, I will spend my time and resources organising young people to go into public service.

Do you consider it safe enough for you to return after your studies?

I have been told that when I return to Nigeria, I will be arrested and detained long enough to be injected with HIV and Hepatitis, so that I die very quickly from natural causes.

This, I understand, is necessary because I am a threat to the Yar’Adua government. I do not understand how a government I played a pivotal role in bringing about will become an overnight enemy. But I believe in God and my destiny.

I will have my medical test results showing I do not have any incurable disease filed with my lawyers in Canada, US and United Kingdom (UK), so that if anything happens to me, my survivors can initiate legal action.

There is nothing more that I can do. Nigeria is my home and I cannot live anywhere else; I would rather die in Nigeria. So I am coming home soon.

There is a lot yet about the Pentascope deal during you tenure at BPE. Do you still insist that you did the best for Nigeria at that time?

We did what was right and what has happened since then confirm the correctness of our decisions. The people that fought tooth and nail to cancel the deal have now been revealed as bribe-takers in the Siemens scandal, and NITEL, as a viable investment proposition had declined, destroyed by greed, selfishness and narrow mindedness.

Pentascope paid salaries and kept the place going. What has happened since then?

The Senate has deliberated on and approved the report of its committee on the FCT, but you are reported to be dissatisfied with the committee’s proceedings and report. What are your reservations?

My attorney, Mr. Bamidele Aturu, has articulated our case better than I ever can and The Guardian carried this. Everything about that Senate Committee from its constitution, non-declaration of pecuniary interest, contrary to Senate’s own rules and disregarding pendency of a court case and so on are being challenged at the Federal High Court.

More than that is the outright falsehood and malice that oozes through each paragraph of the report. Sodangi, Obiorah and Smart Adeyemi all lost plots, hotels and sources of easy money during my tenure in FCT. So it was time to settle scores and that is what they tried to do.

What is sad is that instead of facing me like men, they bastardised a national institution and misled their colleagues in the process. It is sad.

It is alleged that about N32 billion is missing from the proceeds of the sale of federal government houses in the FCT and you are being held accountable for it, a reason the EFCC said it declared you wanted. What happened to the funds?

This is one of the allegations that the Senate Committee made in its several ‘interim reports,’ which were leaked to the media, but was quietly omitted, from the ‘Final Report’ to the Senate. The reason is simple: They lied again.

First, my tenure ended in May 2007 and an audit of the proceeds of sale of government houses was undertaken jointly by Akintola Williams, Deloitte and Aminu Ibrahim & Co. The report was submitted in July 2007, two months after I left office, and not a penny was alleged to be missing then.

This report was made available to the Committee, yet they went ahead to make headlines with their allegation.

I later learnt there was a deal between my immediate successor and the Committee that if they could pin the disappearance of N32 billion on me, there will be some money to share between the two conspirators.

Shortly after the deal was struck, the cabinet was reshuffled and Mr. Remi Babalola, the Minister of State for Finance, recovered N46 billion from 15 bank accounts of the FCT. It turned out that the money was placed on deposit and someone was collecting what they called brokerage. The funds (N46 billion) were transferred to federal government’s account with the Central Bank of Nigeria (CBN).

So how can N32 billion be missing today and you find N46 billion the next day? It is all falsehood propagated to tarnish my reputation and create a situation to enable those in office divert the entire amount.

Again, on this matter, we have gone to court, seeking declaratory judgment and presenting all our facts. We sued the EFCC and have joined the CBN, the Federal Ministry of Finance and the Joint Auditors to contradict the facts, as we know them.

The EFCC threatened to declare me wanted because I refused to abandon my studies to come to Nigeria to further explain what they called ‘PHCN and NIPOST lands.’ When they realised that they had weak legal basis to challenge my authority to revoke and allocate land under both FCT Act and the Land Use Act, they adopted the Senate allegation of ‘missing N32 billion.”

When even the Senate Committee could not sustain that allegation in its Final Report, the EFCC declared me wanted for ‘jumping bail.’

The EFCC has also invited you over the allocation of plots of land that used to belong to NEPA and NIPOST?

The EFCC wrote to me on these matters in June last year and came to my house and I submitted lengthy explanations, with over 100 pages of documents. Then they wrote in October last year inviting me on the same matter, knowing that I am abroad for studies.

I requested them to send any additional question through my lawyer, but they refused, saying that I must appear. Why must I? Are they paying for my ticket? Are we not conducting this interview by email now? Have they never heard of teleconferencing? No, they wanted me to come so that they could seize my passport and frustrate my studies.

James Ibori had boasted that since he cannot go to London, he would ensure that my passport is seized when I come, and this was communicated to me.

That is the problem of PHCN and NIPOST, which are both matters that I have filed two lawsuits. These are just the excuses to enable EFCC please its masters- President Yar’Adua and James Ibori. But what are the real facts?

The so-called NEPA or PHCN plot was a plot owned by the Federal Capital Development Authority (FCDA) for the purpose of building a 330KV substation to connect Abuja to the national grid through Nasarawa State to the East. PHCN changed its plans and decided they needed only a smaller 132kV substation there.

So the plot was redesigned and land set aside for the smaller substation, while 10 or 11 plots were carved out and allocated. Everything was done properly with the input of all land-related departments.

As minister, I had the power to approve the allocations and I did. That is the story of the NEPA/PHCN plot.

The NIPOST plot was allocated to NIPOST over 15 years before I approved its revocation. NIPOST had illegally gone into a sublease agreement with Suleyman Yahyah of Rosehill to build a block of flats or hotel on the plot. I approved its revocation on several grounds, including failure to develop, violation of terms of grant (illegal sublease), and violation of land use. What Rosehill and NIPOST did was criminal to our efforts of restoring sanity in Abuja.

Yet, they had the audacity to petition the government and because we are targets of political persecution, it is given capital.

I have filed another suit against Suleyman Yahyah and Rosehill for libel, because their petition contained tendentious allegations, which I consider actionable. Again, we intend to prosecute this to its logical conclusion and await the judgment of the High Court.

Will you return to Nigeria to answer these charges, and when?

Well, there are still no charges against me, though I have learned that President Yar’Adua has insisted I must be charged even for a traffic violation to convict me as soon as possible. If and when the charges are filed, I will vigorously defend myself. I will return to Nigeria soon.

I hope to be done with my Masters’ program and the Mason Fellowship in June 2009, and then I will go on a short vacation and then come back to Nigeria.

Do you think there is a plan to tarnish the reputation of some of those that served in the Obasanjo cabinet?

No, I do not feel there is a plan. I am certain there is a program to demonise Obasanjo and his high -profile ministers and heads of agencies. It is a major program of the federal government under Yar’Adua. I feel it is of greater priority and importance above the Seven-Point Agenda.

It is alleged that you have difficult relations with President Yar’Adua and his inner circle?

I first met and got to know Umaru Yar’Adua through Sani Maikudi, his cousin and my guardian at Barewa College back in 1972. I considered him my elder brother. The last time I spoke with him was in September 2007 at the inaugural meeting of the National Energy Council.

I resigned from that Council in June last year, as I was coming to Harvard. I do not know the members of his ‘inner circle,’ but Tanimu Yakubu, his Economic Adviser has always been close to me and I still exchange emails with him from time to time.

You are alleged to have initially dismissed Yar’Adua as a presidential material and worked with others to get the courts to reverse his election?

That is untrue. The day President Yar’Adua came to Abuja to pick up his nomination form, he sent Tanimu Yakubu to seek audience with me. I found that strange because usually, when he visits Abuja and we needed to meet, I went to the Katsina State Governor’s Lodge to meet with him, out of the respect I have had for him. But Tanimu was insistent.

So I went home early and Yar’Adua and Tanimu came to inform me of Obasanjo’s invitation to Yar’Adua to file his nomination papers. He asked me to rally the Economic Team behind his candidacy and I did that. I believed strongly in his candidacy and went out of my way to canvass support for it in the Nigerian media and other friends of Nigeria. As I said, Allah will judge between us.

It is not true that I worked with anyone to reverse any election. First, as a public servant and student of Law, I appreciate how difficult the work of judges is. I have never solicited any judge to influence any judgment throughout my life, public or private.

Second, I did not share the view that getting the elections cancelled will lead to any different outcome than we have. And even if the elections are re-run, with (Prof Maurice) Iwu and (Mr. Mike) Okiro in office, Yar’Adua will win again and get a fresh four year term. So why waste the resources?

It is all circulated to justify our persecution… It is sad and disappointing.

What is your opinion on his Seven-Point Agenda?

It is a great shopping list of desirables that is enlightening more by what it does not include in the seven points. For instance, fighting corruption is not on the seven point agenda.

Secondly, the agenda needs to be converted into a clear plan, with priorities and implementation strategies. All the documents I have on the Seven Point Agenda indicate that these are yet to be developed. I hope they get developed soon.

What would be your advice to friends regarding accepting appointment with the present government?

I think every individual should be free to take decisions on whether to serve this government or not, and I believe public service is important and if good people do not do it, bad people will. I will therefore encourage every good and honest person to consider going into public service.

I can answer your question quite categorically in respect of my person. I have observed the government for two years and know the key actors very well. This is not a reforming government. This is a government that lacks courage.

This is a government of double-speak and continuous promises with no foreseeable results or outcomes. This is a government that has little tolerance for mavericks that want to make a difference.

I will never ever serve this kind of government, but I hope others better than me can and will, because Nigeria needs a functioning government utilising the best possible hands. Nigeria is my only country, so I care.

What is your view on corruption, its impact and the war being wagged against it in Nigeria?

Corruption is an evil that has contributed to distorting the incentive structure in Nigeria and has negatively affected our political, economic and social development. It must be fought and brought to a predictable and manageable standstill.

Some countries, like Indonesia, have made progress with significant levels of corruption but its distortion of incentive structures destroys whatever is good in a society in the long run.

The highest point in the anti-corruption war history of Nigeria is still the Mallam Nuhu Ribadu era. Under his courageous leadership, the EFCC was successfully prosecuting at least 100 cases per annum.

This administration is not serious about fighting corruption. It thinks that Nigerians are stupid people who will believe lies when everyone in government repeats them, such as rule of law, anti-corruption with due process, etc. But how many convictions have they secured?

I remember attending a dinner with the British High Commissioner before I left Nigeria, with Babalola and Dr. Faruk Lawan in attendance. He asked us what would signal whether the Yar’Adua government would continue the anti-corruption war so ably started by the Obasanjo administration.

I replied then that if Ibori was actively prosecuted, then the new administration is serious about fighting corruption. I added that if Ribadu were promoted out of his EFCC job, it would be a clear sign that the intentions are suspect. This was in mid-2007. I rest my case.

Do you have any presidential ambition or do you link your current travails to suspicions that you have an interest in the highest office?

No, I do not have any ambitions for political office. I have been there and seen most of it and I feel I have done my bit. About 70 per cent of Nigeria’s population is below the age of 40, so people like me (I will be 50 next year) need to step aside and encourage the emergence of a new generation of public leaders. That is my passion, not holding any office. I am too old.

I want to see everyone older than me retire to their villages to be local government chairmen and allow Obama’s age mates to run the country.

Perhaps I am being suspected of an interest in what you call ‘higher office.’ But if a Nigerian aspires to be President, is that an offense? I have read in newspapers that any political meeting of a few serious politicians is now interpreted as a plot to bring down the Yar’Adua government. What kind of insecure government do we have now?

I reiterate that my passion is to see a young person below the age 49 elected Nigeria’s President in 2011 and beyond. The old people have failed; we need to give things up to the younger ones.

What is your vision of Nigeria?

Nigeria is a country of great resources and capacities suffering from a leadership deficit. We need enlightened and exposed leaders that are bold, courageous and inclusive. We need a national vision that will bring our public leaders and our people together in a broad consensus to move our nation forward, in a way that incentives are placed to reward talent and hardwork, to sanction indolence and deviance, encouraging the strong and protecting the weak, beyond religious or ethnic groupings, states and regions.

I thought Obasanjo laid a good foundation for this to be built upon. It is a disappointment that it has not happened, but we will never give up. This is a burden placed on us by God, as the most populous Black nation on earth.